The notion that Aasiya Hassan's husband was not in fact a moderate, and that he murdered his wife according to ancient Muslim culture and tradition, puts the lie to left's claims that Islam is just another religion - culturally equivalent - and that conservatives are "racist" by identifying Muslims as a clear and present danger to national security on the basis of their beliefs. This backlash illustrates anti-Americanism through and through, and the left's pushback on this story just makes the entire case that much more significant for the debate over creeping Islamization of the West.
Mark Stein, among the best of commentators on the issue, notes that the American press has refused to cover this story accurately, and only one Canadian reporter was willing to break from the mass-media's standard story line (see the Toronto Star, "Man charged in Beheading").
Steyn cuts to the key issue in this debate on Muzzammil Hassan's Islamic "moderation" and the left's claim that this was patriarchic domestic violence:
Spousal murder is not unusual. Beheading your wife is. If Muzzammil Hassan decapitated his as an Islamic ritual, then his entire professional life — Mister Moderate Muslim — was a lie.I'm reading right now Timothy Furnish at the Middle East Quarterly, "Beheading in the Name of Islam," where he notes that "Islam is the only major world religion today that is cited by both state and non-state actors to legitimize beheadings."
Knowing this, it's simply impossible to take people like Melissa McEwan or Repsac3 seriously. These are the left's useful idiots of Islamic terror.
Indeed, when we watch an actual Islamic ritual beheading, the notion of comparing Asiya Hassan to case of "routine" domestic violence against women in the U.S. seems frankly evil.
See, for example, "Valentines Day Al Shabab Style (Beheading)," at Jawa Report - and be hereby notified:
EXTREME CONTENT WARNING. DO NOT WATCH THIS VIDEO ON A FULL STOMACH. NOT FOR THE EASILY UPSET!!!Note: The beheading is reported as originally taking place last October. See, Jihad Watch, "Muslims Behead Christian Convert From Islam in Somalia."
Also, "Somalia: Christian Aid Worker Beheaded for Converting From Islam," and "Brutal Terror Group Seeks Power in Somalia."
If Muzzammil Hassan decapitated his [wife] as an Islamic ritual, then his entire professional life — Mister Moderate Muslim — was a lie.
ReplyDeleteStein's correct. What's getting stuck in the craw of so many "unAmerican" "nihilists" is how quickly folks like you (& even Stein, himself) leave that little "IF" he uses behind in your condemnation. IF this is an honor killing, the guy's a hypocrite. IF it's just a vicious, violent murder, he's just a vicious, violent murderer, but not a Muslim honor killer.
And one more thing, Donald (I've been meaning to mention this since the first post on the subject)... If you're going to use this woman and her murder as a poster for your cause, please do her the honor of at least spelling her name correctly... There's two "a"'s... "Aasiya," not "Asiya"...
Melissa McEwan and I engaged in some spirited badinage last year. I am a qualified Arabist [3-plus Speaking, 4 Reading] with a decade of living in and extended trips to the Middle East as a State Dept Political Officer. Melissa is hopelessly reality-challenged and could not accept my credentials and my experience which belied her total ignorance of the issues, save from an ideological Skinner-box.
ReplyDeleteRepsac3 seems to share some of the delusionary drivel of the left---the basic leftist trope of giving the violent reactionaries in Islam a pass was based on "the enemy of my enemy is my friend."
Since these hyperventilating Bush-haters suffered from BDS of an hysterically irrational degree, they regarded the Muslim terrorists and other enemies of the USA as anti-Bush, and therefore, practical allies in their reality-challenged political agenda.
The Canadian media & the MSM eventually followed suit and the Euro-trash are now reaping the harvest of indulging internal enemies of their national states [France, in particular].
Look for thousands of burning cars in hundreds of French banlieux next summer.
While I'm pretty sure this'll turn out to be a pointless waste of time... ...what the hell, I'm not sleeping, anyway...
ReplyDelete"...giving the violent reactionaries in Islam a pass was based on "the enemy of my enemy is my friend."
Where did I even imply any such thing, Dave? Where am I giving this guy (or anyone else) a pass? What does any of this have to do with Bush?
I think you're just making stuff up as you go along, but please, spout forth...
repsac, by comparing his actions with a Christian memo on spanking, you were more than giving this murderous madman "a pass." If you don't recognize the implications of the silly supercilious drivel you posted on the murder, you fit in with the rest of the morally illiterate and intellectually fraudulent con-men who populate the padded cell of nihilism.
ReplyDeleteGo peddle crack to school kids on street corners. Seems like a better skill-set for your particular frame of mind.
Dave, you're not speaking truth... I never compared this murderer's actions to anyone spanking anyone... If anyone did that at all, it was shoprat. (But really, I wouldn't say he did that, either.) But once Shoprat brought up his "spanking muzzies," I did reply by comparing his offering to spanking christians.
ReplyDelete(That I've had to repeatedly explain this to so many of you folks in such a short time speaks to your collective ability to understand the meanings behind the words... ...or perhaps, you're willingness to fein stupidity in pursuit of an ultimately meaningless point. Either way, with this, I cannot help...)
Nice try, though...
And Bush?
And at the risk of being spanked or disappeared for double posting again, that guy from "The Corner" that we're quoting: Mark Steyn, not Mark Stein. I apologize for my error, but plead that I only copied & pasted the name as I found it in the post.
ReplyDelete" ... repsac, by comparing his actions with a Christian memo on spanking, you were more than giving this murderous madman "a pass" ...
ReplyDeleteThanks Dave. The Christian meme things was so stupid as not even to deserve comment. I did Reppy a favor by deleting the link as spam on my earlier post.
"... ...or perhaps, you're willingness to fein stupidity in pursuit of an ultimately meaningless point. Either way, with this, I cannot help...)"
ReplyDeleteI couldn't have said it any better Repsac.
However, perhaps unlike you, I think there are some seriously sinister alterior motives behind this "feined stupidity" as you so aplty define it.
Notice how Mr. Douglas prefaces all his "Islamic awareness" articles with such colorful hate language as "Islamist decapitation" and so on? In other words, the all out effort to deface certain groups of people with pointed allusions of "decapitation, murder and terror" isn't as coy as he would have liked us to believe. Incase you haven't noticed, there is an under-current of systematic discrimination here, unless there's proof that over a billion people are somehow genetically predisposed to decapitating and murdering people for kicks.
I am sure there is some fringe academic somewhere that would go to the extent of arguing my latter point to be true.
Lets hope its not par for the course.
I have, on my computer, every beheading video I could find on the internet, posted since 9/11. One of these days I'm going to post them all on my blog. You know what i've found out? EVERY one of them was a Muslim. Hmm.
ReplyDeleteAdditionally, traditionally when men in the U.S. kill their wives, it's usually a crime of passion and there are multiple stabbings, shootings, or simply strangling her in a fit of rage. I have never heard of a man beheading his wife as an outlet for spousal abuse or murder.
I've heard of men dismembering them to hide the bodies or try to obfuscate the identities, but just a beheading of a wife? No, that begs the question of motivation. What is the first thing we know about him? Oh yeah, he's a muslim. The "peaceful" religion where the Immams scream for the beheading of Jews, Christians, or for that matter, anyone not Muslim. The same religion that currently condones stoning and beheading as valid means of honor killing.
As I've said in the past, Evil is as Evil does. It has nothing, despite what one commentor posted, to do with genetics. It is a matter of indoctrination. Muslims, and I mean anyone that practices the Muslim faith, well faithfully, believes as he is taught. Christians and Jews are the enemy. They must be killed or converted. Women that dishonor their husbands or family must be killed. These are their beliefs. This is what they are taught in their Madrasahs.
Do I have a distrust for anyone of the Muslim faith? Yeah, I do. No one has ever shown me anything in the last several hundred years that has come from an islamic nation that could even be remotely beneficial to mankind.
Let's see what do they offer today? Opium fields used to fund terrorist camps and organizations. Regular posts on the internet with new beheading videos. Planes crashing into buildings, car bombs, suicide bombers yelling "Alluha Ahkbar" just before they detonate in a crowded Israeli mall, gas attacks in Japanese subways, hijacked planes, riots in France, demands of Sharia law in sovereign nations, fear, oppression, uneducated girls treated like chattel.
Now let's see what positives they've given us... Don't tell me...It's right there on the tip of my tounge.... Oh yeah!!! Falafel! Wait, I don't like falafel...never mind. Someone else try.
I have, on my computer, every beheading video I could find on the internet, posted since 9/11. One of these days I'm going to post them all on my blog.
ReplyDeleteThat says alot about you, Greywolfe, and what it says isn't good.. You probably shouldn't so freely admit such a thing in public. Normal people don't collect such things. I'm sure the families of those decapitated men and women are horrified to know that there are people collecting the videos of their last moments on earth and using them to score cheap political points. (I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and make the assumption that that is your reasoning, rather than anything even more disturbing...)
You know what i've found out? EVERY one of them was a Muslim. Hmm.
Yep, there are some sick Muslims, who make such videos for almost the same reason you collect them. Cheap political points. Both they and a contingent of people on the right, even here in this country, use these videos to scare people into supporting their political or cultural point of view.
Pretty sick.
But then, this guy in Buffalo didn't make a video, did he? So what makes you think his situation is like the ones in your sick, sick videos?
Additionally, traditionally when men in the U.S. kill their wives, it's usually a crime of passion and there are multiple stabbings, shootings, or simply strangling her in a fit of rage. I have never heard of a man beheading his wife as an outlet for spousal abuse or murder.
Here's one: Man Decapitates Wife, Gets In Accident While Disposing Of Head. Head Rolls Onto Street | Clipmarks
Here's another: Insanity or Just Plain Evil -- a Floridian Decapitates Wife and Kills Son - Associated Content
Here's a guy who only got as far as choking his wife (but the intent was there): Man jailed after allegedly threatening to decapitate wife, eat her brain
I'm sorry to say, Grey, this only proves there are stranger, sicker things out there in our own country and among our own people than you're apparently aware of...
What is the first thing we know about him? Oh yeah, he's a muslim.
Sadly, for far too many here, that's the first and only thing you know or need to know about him. It's as though no Muslim can possibly be an all-American Dahmer-style sicko... If you kill and you're Muslim, you kill BECAUSE you're Muslim. No other possibility exists.
The "peaceful" religion where the Immams scream for the beheading of Jews, Christians, or for that matter, anyone not Muslim. The same religion that currently condones stoning and beheading as valid means of honor killing.
Again, there are some sick Imams. But just as cases of pedophile priests do not taint all Catholics (or even all priests), fundie Muslim Imams should not taint all Muslims or all Imams. Why you folks insist on generalizing about a whole culture or religion based on the worst among them, rather that ridding the world of the worst & respecting the rest, escapes me. But it is the very definition of bigotry.
Where are you finding this Muslim condoning of honor killing by any means, let alone the methods you suggest? Please link to a reputable source (one that has no ties to David Horowitz might be nice.)
It is a matter of indoctrination. Muslims, and I mean anyone that practices the Muslim faith, well faithfully, believes as he is taught. Christians and Jews are the enemy. They must be killed or converted. Women that dishonor their husbands or family must be killed. These are their beliefs. This is what they are taught in their Madrasahs.
I'm pretty certain you're wrong, Grey. I'm pretty certain that Muslims here are not being taught these things, and that many Muslims elsewhere aren't either. Having never been to a Mosque or a Madrassa, I cannot say for sure, which makes me wonder why you are as sure of your "facts" as you are... (That said, I'll be glad to check out your evidence, should you choose to offer any...) At the very least, it's insane to believe all Muslims worldwide share the same beliefs on all issues, and worse, that they all hate you. It's demonstrably false.
The fact is, Grey, Muslims are at least as diverse a group as Christians, Jews or other religious groups. Yes, there are fundamentalist Muslims teaching & preaching hate. But they are a small segment of the millions of Muslims there are, and the sooner you folks realize that, the sooner you'll be able to more closely live the American dream, which is at least in part about getting past this constant discrimination against the "other."
Do I have a distrust for anyone of the Muslim faith? Yeah, I do. No one has ever shown me anything in the last several hundred years that has come from an islamic nation that could even be remotely beneficial to mankind.
I feel sorry for you, GreyWolfe. I would never want to think that way about any culture or religion. One clue, buddy... Maybe judging others isn't all about what they can do for you, ya know?
As for contributions other than falafel, here's a list of things you can start boycotting now:
American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee: Arab Contributions to Civilization
This one's alphabetical, even: Salon.com Books | A is for Arabs
Well sure, Repsac, if you're going to bring facts into it, then it looks like there are decapitators that are non-Muslims.
ReplyDeleteIsn't it better, though, to just collect beheading videos to feed your hatred?
For repsac
ReplyDeleteI once told a Catholic priest that if I ever saw him talking to one my kids again or friends kids again, I'd put his head through a wall, and that he could blame his fellow pedophile bretheren for my attitude.
Basically : Catholic Priests and kids, should never ever ever be left in the same room without supervision...
Get it Padre!
For the record though, I DO NOT COLLECT VIDEOS OF THIS TYPE OF BEHAVIOR.
I collect those videos as a reminder of who my enemy is. What he is capable of. To me, it's important to never hide from what's distasteful just because it's politically incorrect to say evil is evil.
ReplyDeleteDuring Desert storm, I saw what muslims do to people that they feel are lesser people for whatever reason. I saw it again with a Sgt. that was in my unit when he decided to marry a Turk and the Army had to move them back to the states because her family tried to kill them both. Don't tell me that honor killing didn't have anything to do with that poor woman's death because the math is there. Just because you are losing your poster boy for tolerant "moderate" muslims, you don't want to do the math. Your REFUSAL to see the truth about EVIL religions is the truly sick thing happening here.
You wanna discuss the possibility that a muslim that kills his wife in such a way is an aborration and not the rule? fine. I'll post the available stats on just how mainstream among muslims that this truly is.
Hey, Greywolfe! Long time no hate, buddy. Is it just me or is anyone else a little worried about what Greywolfe does when he watches his videos? I mean, I think child rapists are the scum of the earth but I don't need to keep a lot of kiddy porn around to remind me of this.
ReplyDeleteYou're banging your head against a wall here, Reppy. This guy thinks Islam is evil. Not just that there are evil practitioners of Islam or that some practitioners of Islam do evil things but that Islam, the religion itself, is evil. Have fun with that.
That's you and me, JBW. We just come here to enjoy the crazy. Repsac is a better man than either of us. He actually presents links of non-Muslims doing beheadings and links of Arab contributions to refute Greywolfe. That takes fortitude.
ReplyDeleteHe's arguing with a guy that collects beheading videos, you know, a mainstream Republican. I realize that I'm a nihilist, but I am somehow repulsed by the idea. I have to wonder if any of the regulars here are, or if they consider it to be normal behavior.
Alright! Polling time. What's everyone think?
I collect those videos as a reminder of who my enemy is. What he is capable of. To me, it's important to never hide from what's distasteful just because it's politically incorrect to say evil is evil.
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry, Greywolfe, but your reasoning is a bit strange, particularly if you were in Desert Storm. Anyone who's seen war first hand shouldn't need reminders of how inhumane man can be to his fellow man. Further, the idea that it is those of us who refrain from collecting and /or viewing such "distasteful" videos who are at fault, because we're somehow being politically correct and/or shielding ourselves from true evil, is quite a stretch of rationalization.
I once again urge you to think of the families of those people whose "faces of death" videos you're considering posting... They no more died for your point of view than for the point of view of the "videographer" who made the video in the first place, and it's no better for you to exploit their life & death than for the terrorists to do so.
Don't tell me that honor killing didn't have anything to do with that poor woman's death because the math is there. Just because you are losing your poster boy for tolerant "moderate" muslims, you don't want to do the math.
My point isn't that it couldn't be an honor killing--indeed, I've said myself that when all the facts are in, it may turn out to be one--but that "the math" for calling it one isn't there, yet. My question is only about the rush in calling it one, and isn't it interesting who's doing the rushing...
Muslim man + dead wife * decapitation != honor killing
In one of Donald's other posts on the subject, he provides a link to a study by Phyllis Chesler, that lists the characteristics of an honor killing vs domestic murder. Seek it out & judge for yourself how many "honor killing" characteristics are and are not so far a part of the official record of this case. She thinks this is an honor killing too, but according to her own standards, not even she can say it is, yet--or should be saying so, anyway...
Aside from this one act (assuming for a second that this one act is a non-moderate Muslim trait, itself), what other evidence can you show that the sick bastard wasn't a moderate Muslim? What else has he said or done that shows him to be the closet fundamentalist you seem to be implying he is? (And then explain why, if all Muslims are EEEEEvil, and thus cannot be trusted, what the point of suggesting he isn't moderate may be? As long as he's Muslim, he's a killer out to take away our American way of life, right? Isn't that what they're all taught?)
((And that brings up some very interesting questions about your fighting alongside them A-rabs in Desert Storm, for the benefit of them A-rabs, that I'll not even try to parse here...))
My thinkin' is actually worse, I think... This guy could be a politically & religiously moderate Muslim, AND a sick depraved man. Or, some others may be right, and he could've done this as an honor killing, making him far less moderately Muslim than he ever appeared. The only thing I'm pretty sure of is that he isn't a killer just because he is a Muslim. You're welcome to that particular math if you want it, but to me it's just bigotry.
You wanna discuss the possibility that a muslim that kills his wife in such a way is an aborration and not the rule? fine. I'll post the available stats on just how mainstream among muslims that this truly is.
Save your stats, Greywolfe. You don't need to prove honor killings exist. I know they do. The issue is whether this murder by this man is an honor killing, and why some folks (particularly on the right) are so eager to say it is, without providing the facts of the case to back up their claims.
Rather than spouting statistics, compare the facts of this case to the facts present in other honor killings, particularly the cultural & religious beliefs expressed by the assailants prior to the crimes, their words afterward, whether or not other family members were involved (& what their reactions to the crimes were)... Honor killings imply more than just male Muslim perp + dead female family member(s)... Compare this case (& all those factors) to that of the Said sisters in TX (definitely honor killings), and see if you can spot the differences...
I can see how pogroms get started. This is group hate 101
ReplyDeleteAs much as they proclaim themselves the champions of freedom, diversity, womens rights and all that, you'd think that liberals would be the first to criticize Islam.
ReplyDeleteInstead, this is what we get
"But just as cases of pedophile priests do not taint all Catholics (or even all priests), fundie Muslim Imams should not taint all Muslims or all Imams. Why you folks insist on generalizing about a whole culture or religion based on the worst among them, rather that ridding the world of the worst & respecting the rest, escapes me. But it is the very definition of bigotry."
Sigh. Toleration for violence is widespread in Islam, not to mention support for the reprehensible system of law called Sharia.
I've blogged on this until my fingers are blue, but if you demand a citiation, here's a survey in the UK in which Killing for religion is justified, say third of Muslim students. What else does the survey show?
* 40 per cent support the introduction of sharia into British law for Muslims
* a third back the notion of a worldwide Islamic caliphate (state) based on sharia law
* 40 per feel it is unacceptable for Muslim men and women to mix freely
* 24 per cent do not think men and women are equal in the eyes of Allah
* a quarter have little or no respect for homosexuals
So it's not bigotry, but based on fact.
Killing for religion is justified. Isn't that what Greywolfe was saying?
ReplyDeletederanged is a good name for you baker. Where in my post did I say anything resembling your last remark? You're an idiot and not worth arguing with. I'll give kudos where they're due, I may fundamentally disagree with repsac3 but at least he argues on merit (as he sees it)and his perception of the facts and doesn't launch unmerited attacks (unless attacked). My advice to you is to grow up. You remind me of my sister's kids.
ReplyDeleteoh and repsac3, I checked your the links to arab contributions to society and you proved my point. All of them are from ancient history. Nothing, well other than kebabs, latte, and watermelon, any modern use. Say within the last 200 years? So far as I've seen muslim nations have exported fear, intolerance, oil, and heroin. Other than that.... nope I'm coming up dry.
ReplyDeleteAnd some of the stuff on the second site was reaching, I mean come on, giving them credit for Dante?