The Newsweek survey finds across-the-board support for full civil equality for gay Americans, but on the key question of definining marriage as between one man and one women, the country is a long way from overturning what is seen by a majority as a divine union of spouses.
Here's the key question item:
Thinking again about legal rights for gay and lesbian couples, which of the following comes CLOSEST to your position on this issue? Do you support FULL marriage rights for same-sex couples, OR support civil unions or partnerships for same-sex couples, BUT NOT full marriage rights, OR do you oppose ANY legal recognition for same-sex couples?For all Americans, 31 percent support gay marriage, 32 percent civil unions, and 30 percent want no legal protection for gay marriage or civil unions.
Newsweek's essay stresses the growing tolerance for homosexuals in society overall:
When voters in California, Florida and Arizona approved measures banning same-sex marriage last month, opponents lamented that the country appeared to be turning increasingly intolerant toward gay and lesbian rights. But the latest NEWSWEEK Poll finds growing public support for gay marriage and civil unions—and strong backing for the granting of certain rights associated with marriage, to same-sex couples.But on the controversy over same-sex unions, it all depends on how question items are posed: When respondents were asked if they supported some kind of legally-sanctioned gay and lesbian partnerships, 55 percent agreed. But when questions are broken down precisely on the issue of traditional marriage, less than one-third support the traditional conception of marriage for homosexual couples.
On every other measure of civil equality for gay Americans, the public showed majority support - for example, on adoption and inheritance rights for gay or lesbian couples; Social Security benefits for same-sex domestic partners; health insurance and other employee benefits, hospital visitation rights, openly gay service in the military; equal protection in workplace hiring and promotion; equality in housing opportunity; and gays and lesbians should be allowed to teach elementary and high school children.
On all of these items, a majority of Americans support homosexual equality.
The most striking finding, however, is that a majority of 62 percent of Americans say religious beliefs are central to defining marriage, with a plurality of 41 percent of Americans seeing marriage as exclusively a religious matter.
This is why radical leftists attack Americans who are religious traditionalists as "Christianists."
For gay rights activists to achieve their goal of full marriage equality under the law, they must marginalize Americans of faith who reject a redefinition of culture away from traditional or scriptural foundations.
See more analysis of the gay marriage controversy here.
18 comments:
Thanks Philippe!
I'm no math genius, but if you look at trends in this survey, it's encouraging for those of us who reject marriage segregation.
Donald, why don't you point out the trends? I would say that in 20 years or less we won't be having this argument. Gay segregation will lose, just like all forms of injustice eventually do.
Prove me wrong.
Why not point out the specific percentages for each item you list as being supported by Americans? I don't see the 31% number listed anywhere in the Newsweek report, though it's not for from the 34% they do report.
Nevertheless, they do report 86% support the availability of hospital visits (as the absence of next of kin rights would deny), 67% support granting Social Security rights (so federal moneys aren't an issue for most), 66% think gays should be permitted to serve in the military, and even a bare majority of 53% believe gays should be able to adopt.
Why not acknowledge, as Tim points out, that the trends have ONLY been in one direction since such polls have been reported?
As a political scientist living in a democracy you surely are sensitive to political trends. All recent polls indicate that the generation of your students overwhelmingly support full gay rights. What do you think the future of gay marriage in America will be with two states (and until a month ago three), many industrialized countries including Canada, and young voters learning to flex their muscles?
Are you sure most gay folks don't just want the rights, in the first place?
I've not seen much evidence of their looking to change the spiritual definition of marriage or force churches to perform ceremonies... (Yes, there's always a few crackpots, but one would have to be an idiot to believe those few define the whole.)
From all I've seen, it's about rights in the first place, and for all the claims of "marginalizing Americans of faith" or redefinitions of culture away from traditional or scriptural foundations," no one's shown any different.
If all the same rights are granted to those who civilly unite, without their using the word marriage, would that be acceptable, or would that still be a redefinition of culture away from traditional or spiritual foundations (because it is tolerating or condoning--& to some, perhaps, even rewarding--sinful behavior) of which you speak?
Blues Papa: Click on the link at the Newsweek poll, for the raw data. I quoted from that:
"Thinking again about legal rights for gay and lesbian couples, which of the following comes CLOSEST to your position on this issue? Do you support FULL marriage rights for same-sex couples, OR support civil unions or partnerships for same-sex couples, BUT NOT full marriage rights, OR do you oppose ANY legal recognition for same-sex couples?"
Only 31 percent said they support gay marriage.
Before you attack me at least get your facts correct.
Repsac3:
Gays have full equality, and majority support for it, as evidenced by the poll findings.
The problems, as I've written many times, is that same-sex marriage is not a civil right. Not in federal law and not in public opinion.
All of you want to focus on trends, but people generally grow more conservative as they get older, and traditional cultures are enduring on key questions, such as this, obviously so.
The left not only lost on this issue at the polls decisively in November, public opinion has confirmed it's a national repudiation of the gay rights push to redefine marriage.
"I've moved to the 30% that say "no civil unions". Expect that shift... not a shift to more acceptance. You'll see a more powerful shift soon, I believe."
I think you're onto something there, Grace!
Grace.
You are pretty sick and twisted if you believe what you actually wrote. I'm not so sure Jesus would be proud of your disgraceful, condemning nature. Would he?
Where did he talk of homosexuality anyway?
If you want to talk of abominations, have you had any shrimp lately? How about pork? Have you made the proper sacrifices, as detailed in Leviticus?
Are you a slave owner? Because provided they come from Mexico or Canada, you are OK. It has to be a bordering country.
Have you killed any homosexuals lately? Because you should if you are privy to their behavior. It says so in the bible.
Christianity I am not against. Twisted, perverted logic such as yours, I abhor. In the extreme.
Legender... Why is what Grace wrote sick and twisted?
There are quite a few facts in her statement you did not address with your simplistic reply.
Is homosexuality a sin or not?
Jesus addressed the issue of lust in the book of Matthew, chapter 5:27 You have heard that it was said, 'Do not commit adultery.' But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
You can deny that lust is involved in homosexual relationships but most people will roll their eyes as you do so...
Simple fact of the matter is that lust is involved and lust is a sin.
You can deny that lust, God and sin exist but you cannot deny Christians the right to believe as they do.
Bringing up Old Testament law is really silly because Jesus replaced the Levitical law with God's grace and mercy which is found through a relationship with the risen Jesus Christ.
He rose from the dead and will come into your heart if you seek Him. I found that all other issues on this planet are secondary to this matter of gaining a one on One relationship with God.
I'm reminded of Matt 6:33 which states: So do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?' For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.
Try seeking His kingdom first and sodomy second...
A civil union is different than marriage.
Marriage is a religious insitution created by God and the definition cannot change outside of what God defines... or it isn't marriage anyway.
I agree that marriage is a religious rite, which is why it should be defined by the God one worships, rather than by US law. (Since when has any church or denomination allowed the US government to define ANY religious rite? Is there any other religious rite defined by or written into US law?)
As long as "marriage" is the term used in US law for determining the rights & privileges a couple receives for uniting, I'm as in favor of gay marriage as I am straight marriage. I believe that gay citizens are as entitled to full "marriage" rights as straight citizens.
But in my heart, I believe that marriage is a religious matter rather than a legal one, and that no one but God should be defining marriage for any person or society, AND that local state & federal law ought to be defining rights, rather than rites.
Once "marriage" ceases to be a term of law, and is replaced by a term that gives the same rights & privileges to all who unite by law, I will withdraw my support for legal gay marriage. In that respect, I guess I'm a part of that 31%...
As I said earlier, I see almost no one looking to redefine the sacrament of marriage as celebrated in churches all across this land. I see a class of people in search of legal rights & privileges denied them by the state on the basis of the gender of themselves & their beloved.
The way I read that poll, even accounting for the fact that people tend to get more politically/socially conservative as they age, acceptance of all individual rights for gay people (including the right to legally "marry" -- though I expect not religiously marry) is increasing over time. Even accounting for the fact that age makes us more conservative, the trend is toward more legal acceptance of inalienable rights for all citizens, including gay citizens.
The most troubling aspect I saw in that poll is how few see marriage as a religious matter, rather than a legal matter, or both. By using the term "marriage" in law, we have diluted it's sacred, spiritual meaning among the people.
"The most troubling aspect I saw in that poll is how few see marriage as a religious matter, rather than a legal matter, or both. By using the term "marriage" in law, we have diluted it's sacred, spiritual meaning among the people."
You're kidding, or you're blind, RepmasterSmash!
62 percent say a religious component, and 41 percent - the plurality - see religion explicitly in marriage. You lose, again.
prying1: Grace said: "I would favor recriminalization of homosexuality."
That is sick, twisted, and goes against what anyone right now wants, except for those damaged by their religious "beliefs." (See the Reverend Fred Phelps and his God Hates Fags campaign). People like Grace pervert the words of Jesus and the bible.
The Old Testament analogies are thrown in because the bible is supposed to be the word of your god (not mine, thankfully) and it is infallible. Besides, when the whack job Christians want to justify anything, they pick and choose freely between the two books to satisfy their own perverted ends.
Again, your testimony here and Grace's obscene banter merely underline why I do not subscribe to the brainwashing cult of Christianity. Just look at your words.
I do, however, love the teachings of Christ. He's a great philosopher, as Bush so rightfully said.
I think those numbers are far lower than they should be, Nero m'boy...... If you're happy with 'em (perhaps because you feel they're good enough to "win" the current gay marriage battle, and that's all that matters), more power to you... But for those who believe, they just aren't good enough. If believing makes me a loser in your eyes, you're welcome to gloat all you wish...
Congratulations on you're "win," for whatever you think it's worth...
Grace, can you prove that your "objetive truth" is somehow more relevent than my objective truth?
Based on your previous arguments I am sure you wouldn't be reluctant to attempt it, so please grant us some humor!
"I have retracted that position. I would favor recriminalization of homosexuality. I don't agree that it's "inborn". I believe with historical positions that it's a psychological problem (another term for the influence of sin on the soul and psyche). It's sin. That makes it a psychological disorder and soul sickness. "
Ahhh but Grace, did you know that the American psychological institute has removed homosexuality as a "psychological problem in the 1970's? We know that fundie christian fanatics like yourself tend to be behind the times and regress back to a more primitive form of moral reasoning that is separate from the logic and reasoning used in the sciences.
It just happens to be even more appauling that you have the "testicular fortitude"(sarcasm intended), to attempt a scientific explanation for your obvious fanaticism.
Dear Grace
Marriage may be part of religious traditions but the ceremony at the church means nothing in the eyes of the law. It is a civil right and comes with 1138 protections under the law. And while "just" 31 percent support gay marriage, another 30 percent support civil unions. That is a clear majority.
People who hate eventually lose. Is this really what you think Jesus would do? I just plain feel sorry for you. It's no wonder gay people hide when they have to live in fear of people like you.
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