Frum then indicates that Shrum is an extreme outlier in the Democratic Party's ranks, where the great majority of Democratic partisans have recoild from moral condemnation of Hamas' diabolical campaign of destruction against the Jewish state:
Shrum represents an increasingly minority point of view within the Democratic Party. A Rasmussen poll conducted in the last week of 2008 found that while 62 percent of Republicans backed Israel’s action in Gaza, only 31 percent of Democrats did. Almost three-quarters of Republicans blamed Hamas for starting this war; only a minority of Democrats agreed. Republicans are 20 points more friendly toward Israel than Democrats. And while extreme hostility to Israel does not exist among Republicans, almost one in 10 Democrats describes Israel as an “enemy of the United States.”This is the political environment in which Barack Obama will be forming policy toward the Jewish state. Friends of Israel should find this worrying to say the least.
Democratic revulsion at Israel’s Gaza operation has multiple roots.
First, Democrats are just generally less likely to support military actions by any nation, including the United States. A 2005 MIT poll found that only 57 percent of Democrats would support the use of American troops even to destroy a terrorist training camp. (Compared to 95 percent of Republicans.)
Second, Democrats hold an inexhaustible faith in the value of negotiation. Untroubled by Hamas’ character as a terrorist movement pledged to the total destruction of Israel and the murder of its population, 55 percent of Democrats believe that Israel should have tried to find a diplomatic solution to the Hamas rocket barrage.
Third, the more closely Americans follow the news, the more likely they are to support Israel. Yet more low-information voters are Democrats than Republicans.
Fourth, Democratic attitudes are poisoned by the influence of an anti-Zionist hard left, a vociferous faction whose ideology can bleed into outright anti-Semitism. The foreign policy page at the Barack Obama transition website, Change.gov, features many disturbing examples of this trend. There you will find questions and comments like the following:
“How might you propose to hold Israel accountable for their awful record of human rights abuses? My personal sense is that Israeli abuse of non-Jewish residents in Middle East is our #1 problem.”
“The root cause of the world's problems is the Israeli occupation of Palestine and the ongoing war crimes perpetrated by Israel.”
“The massacre of the Palestinian people by the excessive forces of Israeli military should be soundly condemned—why is Obama NOT taking a MORAL stand on this holocaust? Shocking!”
“What will you do to help end the illegal and immoral occupation of Palestine, to end the oppression of the Palestinian people by the genocidal government of Israel?
“How will President Obama uncouple the ‘Israeli Lobby’ from the US political process, to prevent its current undue influence over U.S. foreign and domestic policy?”
This last part about the attitudes of the "anti-Zionist hard-left" is really key. In fact, there's more fever swamp comments cited at the piece.
Frum suggests that Obama's key challenge on Middle East policy will be to "overcome the institutional flaws in his party."Actually, Obama's so far doing a bit better than I expected, but if any policy issue helps to validate the "secret theory of progressivism," the new administration's approach to Israel will take the cake.
19 comments:
Interesting polling. But the main disconnect for me is this: I know a lot of Jews here in Los Angeles. Every single one is pretty hard core liberal. Every one. And, unless I am mistaken, Jews vote predominantly Democratic. No?
I know you are talking low-information Democrat, but still...
One reason for Republicans being so in favor of Israel is that that a significant segment fall under the "end times" cult, the ones who are praying for the rapture.
There's an interesting psychology at play here, as Christians have no time for Judaism on the whole, given their religious intolerance predilections.
Someone like Grace I am sure can answer this question: Will a good Jew, who does not accept Jesus, go to heaven?
The answer, if you are true to your faith, is no.
So, if that is the case, Jews and atheists are both going to hell, as are Muslims. Yet 2/3 of those groups are hated and despised by the right as unrighteous and morally lacking.
I would say the right is demonstrating some moral cowardice of their own.
For the record, it's not "moral cowardice," but it is compassion for the 700 Palestinians killed, and the ghettoization they endure.
Meanwhile, how about some more crocodile tears for a zygote?
Moral cowardice indeed.
That's interesting. Tim: why is your "main disconnect" the fact there are Jews who are democratic in LA ? What has that have to do with questions in the poll ? How does the fact that there are democratic Jews in LA "disconnect" anything about this poll ?
You write about the "ghettoization" of the people in Gaza. What are you joking. The Gaza Strip is part of the huge Arab world that surrounds Israel. If the fellow Arabs in Egypt will not let them in then its a Egyptian/Gazan problem.
Now I will tell you who lives in a "ghetto". When one lands in Israel at Ben Gurion Airport outside of Tel Aviv one can travel North about 150 miles before running into a huge fence, with landmines, at Lebanon. One can travel South about 150 miles before running into a fence with landmines at Egypt. One can travel East about 8 miles before hitting a fence at the West Bank, and one can travel West about 10 miles before hitting the beaches of the Mediterranean. Inside this little "Ghetto" are about 6 million Jews and 1.5 million Israeli Arabs.
It is the Jews who are truly living in a ghetto, but that's ok because it is their homeland and we have been fighting for few thousand years. In fact, you can see ruins from the Roman forts all over the Judean Desert from the last Jewish revolt 1800 years ago.
The Gaza Strip is really part of Egypt and part of the huge Arab world surrounding the "Ghetto". Yours is a common misconception by Americans who tend to think of every country is as large as the USA.
Lastly, I would rather believe that religion has very little to do with the support for Israel. I would rather think that most people use their intelligence and understand that Israel exemplifies western values of freedom and not some 7th century beliefs towards women, gays and a world wide caliphate.
Tim: Many Jewish liberals, some have argued, are secular and essentially anti-Zionist.
Why don't these same folks take Israel's side in the polling data?
I was watching CNN yesterday and every Democrat they asked supported Israel Professor. What ridiculous right wing propaganda site did you find this poll of yours on anyway?
The point of view Frum seems to be holding is genocide of the Palestinian People. And for this joker to claim Dems are poisoned by anti Zionists is ultimate hypocrisy when he and the right have been drinking the Bush koolaid for years.
Also Professor: for Frum to try and make a link that because somebody posted an opinion on an Obama website that meant Obama agreed with it is very dishonest of this guy. You probably disagree with most of my comments but because you allow them this deluded fool Frum might post that you agree with them as he did the Obama site comments.
I would hope that a Professor, even a neocon one, would have more integrity than to put misleading propaganda like Frum's on his site. Certainly you can do better yourself than this cut and paste job Professor.
Tim resorts to the usual weak arguments defending his anti-semitism. Jews in this country support the policies of THIS country and historically have been and may continue to be Democrats. They do not see themselves as Israelis and in fact many are Jewish in name only. In addition, Obama certainly put out enough signals in Florida that he would not take up an anti Israeli stance. American Jews, with good reason, are afraid of retaliation from being identified as the perpetrators of aggression as portrayed inaccurately by the left wing press who love every piece of low grade propaganda as if it were their first born. Tim probably forgets that not too many years ago Jews were kept out of clubs and hotels and still many Jews they face poisonous anti-semetic hatred every day. Europeans embrace anti-Zionism without even having a single clue as to the history and goals of Zionism. They then like to point out that it is not the same as "anti-semitism" which of course they would never be guilty of. Not much. Planting few trees at Auschwitz does little to erase memory. ALeft wing Americans are for the most part shamelessly ignorant of the FACTS of the Middle East since they prefer sound bites and pictures. Lots of pictures. They are sitting ducks for photoshop propaganda. They love it.
Christians value Judism as the foundation on which Christianity was built. Heres a flash for all you snti-semites out there who think the Christian right hates Jews. Jesus was a Jew...a county rabbi. Jews value all religion as a profound part of human expression.
Israel is the Jewish homeland and has been since time immemorial. Even the most far left fool has to admit that this is true. Israel never wanted to rule Palestine...just to make them (and the rest of the world) to stop trying to wipe them off the face of the earth. Probably ain't gonna happen. Not in our lifetime. Too many left wing morons loving that hate. Thats just anti-semitism and it is as old as dirt.
Question of philosophy for kateliz. If Jesus knew he was the Saviour how could he be Jewish. He should by definition of "Saved" been the first Christian.
Aside from that, they say imitation is the highest form of flattery. It looks like you've taken my postings and used the catch phrases to make some misleading right wing points. Two of your points using "propaganda" and the "keeping Jews out of country clubs" stand out prominently.
Truth101: The poll is Rasmussen, one of the most respected survey outfits around. Frum says this:
"Democratic attitudes are poisoned by the influence of an anti-Zionist hard left, a vociferous faction whose ideology can bleed into outright anti-Semitism."
I think this is why you're so uptight.
Truth:
I live in a area that is quite Jewish and there are many left wing Jews who: a) are not Zionists, and b) do not support any military action by Israel
You are the one spouting the ridiculous propaganda.
Thanks for your input, Philippe!
Thanks for commenting, Kateliz.
I exposed Frum as misleading right wing schill and the Professor as his enabler Norm. You can put any spin you want on the truth if it makes you feel better about your deluded right wing system.
If the pain of truth gets too bad for you maybe you could score some oxycontin from Rush Limbaugh.
katelitz: I don't know who the hell you think you are calling me an anti-semite. Show me one quotation of mine to support this. One. There is not a single bone in my body that is anti-semitic. I'm guessing you are little more than a blog troll as I've never seen you here before.
Norm: I have been the length and breadth of Israel. I know it intimately. I don't need your geography lesson, thank you. I gave a month of my life to a kibbutz, working hard for little or no money just so I could experience life there.
Phil: You have a fundamental failure to comprehend the bible and its teachings, with special regard to the new testament.
"I am the way and the light..."
And John 3:16: "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."
Um, a Jewish belief? Not so much.
I was taught at my Catholic schools that Jews and Arabs would not go to heaven. That's what I'm pointing out here, the stupidity of even having that argument. As an atheist, I think you are all insane, talking to voices in your head. But that's just me.
Good for you Tim, after working in Israel for one month you understand what geographical claustrophia is all about. An American yearns to get in the car and drive a few hours without hitting a border.
Tim hold up. "One reason for Republicans being so in favor of Israel is that that a significant segment fall under the "end times" cult, the ones who are praying for the rapture."
1st off, those cats are not so focused on - uh - wordly stuff - like geodiplopolitical concerns. Their gig is mostly trying to convince others to join their team ala religion.
2nd, Americans in general support Little Satan because - she is a lot like us.
A tolerant, egalitarian society with a penchant for transparent periodic elections, a free, uncensored press, a military undercivie control, a natl treasury under public scrutiny and an independent judiciary.
And that doesn't mean Little Satan is magical. Americans support Taiwan, SoKo, Georgia, Philippines and Nippon too.
More like a Hot! Democrazy Cult than an end times deal.
courtneyme109, I won't lie: you look like a pretty hot educated southern chick in your profile (which I love), and I admit that you know more about the Middle Eastern situation than I'll ever know or want to know.
But your style of prose is annoying on a level approaching unreadable. I went to your site and tried to ingest some of your thoughts. I found the entire process intolerable. The whole "capital letter, lowercase letter" thing: extraordinarily annoying. Just wanted to let you know, darlin'.
Courtneyme109,
Americans will support any poop hole as long as it serves its rightful role as a satellite butt-kissing state.
The Suharto's, Batistas', and Saddams' are those you'd call "democracy cult leaders" ehh???
Poli-sci degrees in a cracker jacks box anyone?
Courtney: If I'm not mistaken, and given the success of the "Left Behind" series of books, there are a lot of kooks who walk among us. One of them I know personally...nice, intelligent, even liberal, but she believes the rapture is imminent. I honestly don't know what to say to these people.
But yes, you are right Israel is like us, only not. They have mandatory service, which makes total sense. And given that it is a state based on a religion/race, they are remarkably secular.
Politically, yes. Except not, as they have a parliamentary system.
Hi JBW, thanks for the kind words. Appreciate the visit - prose concerns noted though to be fair - the up and down cap thing appears only on the side bar and it is generally used among younger ppl. Probably see more of it in the future as cats grow into blogging.
As far as annoying - it is true that GsGf is audacious and optismistic. Give me time. I'm still young.
Hi CS, that commentary is probably best applied to the ammoral, corrupt cult of realpolitik than any Foreign Policy and Diplomatic endeavors since 911.
Online retractions anyone?
Hi Tim. So what? I know ppl that think Hawthorne Heights are bigger than the Beatles - though they don't buy music anywhere, subscribe to Rolling Stone or support the music industry in any way.
End Times Xians - are more interested in 'reaping the harvest' soul wise - geting folks to become Xians etc than voting, following the news in depth and if they do actually follow events historical and au currant note they only use the Bible to support view among other Xians - they mostly use the secular arguments because their 'End Times' views would get them quickly dismissed from serious consideration.
Ohh Courtneyme, rather desengenious of you to be trying to revert to the point in history which is of your own convenience isn't it?
Interestingly enough, your attempt at reverting to post 9/11 as the foundation of American foreign policy, addresses my main issue with said policies. That is, future policy cannot forget the short-sightedness of past digressions. Otherwise, one ends up making the same mistakes, over and over and over and over again. Its happening as we speak....
The commie boogiemen turned into the Arab Fundie did they? Whats next?
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